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It's past the time
5 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2012 - 3:35PM #21
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 9,050

OK, fine so instead of $1.3 trillion dollar deficits annually they would be about $700 billion dollar deficits which is still an epic fail.  Would it have been nice if the Iraq War didn't happen, sure hind sight is 20/20.  Afghanistan?  Other than Ron Paul's idea of richly rewarding mercenaries to fight a proxy war against Al Qaeda for us would any adminstration have reacted differently.  Was not retaliating an option?  Please don't tell me we allowed it to happen so we could go to war or that it was an inside job.

5 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2012 - 5:44PM #22
ArtVandelay
Posts: 28,396

Dec 5, 2012 -- 3:35PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


OK, fine so instead of $1.3 trillion dollar deficits annually they would be about $700 billion dollar deficits which is still an epic fail.  Would it have been nice if the Iraq War didn't happen, sure hind sight is 20/20.  Afghanistan?  Other than Ron Paul's idea of richly rewarding mercenaries to fight a proxy war against Al Qaeda for us would any adminstration have reacted differently.  Was not retaliating an option?  Please don't tell me we allowed it to happen so we could go to war or that it was an inside job.




you forgot the free oil that we stole...  when gas went below $1 a barrel it was obvious why we went to war...  oh...  wait a minute...

5 years ago  ::  Dec 05, 2012 - 9:09PM #23
BoogiedownBx
Posts: 1,082

Dec 4, 2012 -- 9:09AM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


I can feel the edge of this cliff getting closer and closer.


My money is that they go over it ... a lot easier for the Republicans to vote for tax cuts in January, than it is for them to vote for tax increases on anyone in December.




Although you are correct, isn't that the most ridiculous sounding thing you've heard in a while? They can't vote for tax increases because their constitunecy and corporate masters say it is verboten.


They took an oath to the people of the United States, then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist. The GOP needs to get its act together and fast, for the sake of all Americans.

5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 8:45AM #24
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 9,050

Dec 5, 2012 -- 9:09PM, BoogiedownBx wrote:


Although you are correct, isn't that the most ridiculous sounding thing you've heard in a while? They can't vote for tax increases because their constitunecy and corporate masters say it is verboten.


They took an oath to the people of the United States, then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist. The GOP needs to get its act together and fast, for the sake of all Americans.




I can think of a few more ridiculous sounding things.  How about the fact that the nation's Gross Domestic Product or the annual market value of the goods and services produced within our borders is currently $15.5 trillion while the total current U.S. National Debt is $16.4 trillion.  Revenue to Local, State, and Federal governments within our borders is currently 32.6% of GDP and spending by Local, State, and Federal governments is currently 41%.  We need to bridge a divide of more than 26% between revenues and spending just to stop digging ourselves deeper and that doesn't even include starting to dig out of our hole.  If we give Obama the tax increases on the top 2% that will increase revenue $700 billion over the next decade, if we go over the cliff and do nothing that will cut the gap between revenue and spending by about $700 billion which still leaves us in the hole by about $600-$700 billion in 2013.  No matter how you look at it we must reduce spending and the Republicans have to distance themselves from Cheney, defits do matter.

5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 10:30AM #25
GottaGoToMo
Posts: 67,621

Dec 5, 2012 -- 9:09PM, BoogiedownBx wrote:


Dec 4, 2012 -- 9:09AM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


I can feel the edge of this cliff getting closer and closer.


My money is that they go over it ... a lot easier for the Republicans to vote for tax cuts in January, than it is for them to vote for tax increases on anyone in December.




Although you are correct, isn't that the most ridiculous sounding thing you've heard in a while? They can't vote for tax increases because their constitunecy and corporate masters say it is verboten.


They took an oath to the people of the United States, then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist. The GOP needs to get its act together and fast, for the sake of all Americans.




That's a good point ... they took an oath to the people of the United States, but then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist ... never heard anything so ridiculous in my entire life!

5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 10:34AM #26
prof. quiz
Posts: 6,037

Dec 5, 2012 -- 5:44PM, ArtVandelay wrote:


you forgot the free oil that we stole...  when gas went below $1 a barrel it was obvious why we went to war...  oh...  wait a minute...



I truly believe Shrub & Co. invaded Iraq for lucrative oil contracts to pay back the shadow people who financed his election. Just like John D had the govt in his pocket 150 years ago today it's the Koch suckers or ExxonMobil. It's the same old BS rhetoric only disemminated to a cyber society at the speed of light as opposed to the cumbersome mechanical dance of Gutenbergs design.


Do you really believe we marched into Iraq for humanitarian reasons?


Why is our military budget 7 times that of China? Who is crazy enough to screw with us? We already have over 5,000 nuclear warheads that can be delivered with pin-point accuracy anywhere on the planet. The cold war cooled off not because of Raygunz diplomatic efforts but the reality is we outspent everyone else. We police the world to protect our colonialistic financial interests.


Taxes, defecits, blah, blah blah. Too few control too much. Tarbell warned us about Rockefeller. Eisenhower warned us about the Industrial Military Complex. What have we learned from history? Apparently nothing.




5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 11:13AM #27
MAX
Posts: 34,253

Dec 5, 2012 -- 3:35PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


OK, fine so instead of $1.3 trillion dollar deficits annually they would be about $700 billion dollar deficits which is still an epic fail.


It's a start. Would you rather owe 1.3 or half that amount?


 


  Would it have been nice if the Iraq War didn't happen, sure hind sight is 20/20.


Sorry, there were people against it from the start. We were also promised by Bush that the Iraqi oil revenue was going to pay for the war. (R) keep forgetting that.


 


  Afghanistan?  Other than Ron Paul's idea of richly rewarding mercenaries to fight a proxy war against Al Qaeda for us would any adminstration have reacted differently.  Was not retaliating an option?  Please don't tell me we allowed it to happen so we could go to war or that it was an inside job.




Afghanistan is a different story. But it still doesn't justify lowing taxes on the wealthy when the Country's costs just skyrocketed because of the war.

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5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 11:18AM #28
MAX
Posts: 34,253

Dec 6, 2012 -- 10:30AM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


Dec 5, 2012 -- 9:09PM, BoogiedownBx wrote:


Dec 4, 2012 -- 9:09AM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


I can feel the edge of this cliff getting closer and closer.


My money is that they go over it ... a lot easier for the Republicans to vote for tax cuts in January, than it is for them to vote for tax increases on anyone in December.




Although you are correct, isn't that the most ridiculous sounding thing you've heard in a while? They can't vote for tax increases because their constitunecy and corporate masters say it is verboten.


They took an oath to the people of the United States, then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist. The GOP needs to get its act together and fast, for the sake of all Americans.




That's a good point ... they took an oath to the people of the United States, but then signed a pledge to Grover Norquist ... never heard anything so ridiculous in my entire life!





Bush 41 and his wife Barbara agree with you.



 


"The rigidity of those pledges is something I don’t like," Bush said. "The circumstances change and you can’t be wedded to some formula by Grover Norquist. It’s -- who the hell is Grover Norquist, anyway?"


His wife, former First Lady Barbara Bush, did not mince her words either when it came to the anti-tax crusader.


"I think he ought to go back to Alaska," she said, referring to previous comments she made about Sarah Palin in a 2010 interview. "Don't quote me!"



 

 

.
5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 12:43PM #29
Yankee1954
Posts: 8,749

Dec 4, 2012 -- 7:28AM, newinn wrote:


for the Republicans and the President to get together in a room and hammer out a deal to prevent going over the fiscal cliff and fix the debt problem. Both sides presented laughable proposals and continue to play politics with our lives. Stop campaigning Mr. President and start leading. We get it you won but so did those Republicans with opposing views that also represent constituents.
Wondering if you guys think we will go over the edge or if you think a deal will be struck? 




 


Sorry New but there is a difference between the Presidency and some House member! That woud be like saying Bachmann and Obama are the same! Come on now, you know how this works. When you negotiate you don't throw your best offer out to let the other side rip it tp pieces. Obama wants to have Republicans senda proposal that cuts programs and says what is to be cut. The R's want Obama to do the same so they can say he went back on his word.

5 years ago  ::  Dec 06, 2012 - 12:47PM #30
Yankee1954
Posts: 8,749

Dec 4, 2012 -- 1:33PM, ArtVandelay wrote:


Dec 4, 2012 -- 12:30PM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


Dec 4, 2012 -- 12:08PM, MAX wrote:


Dec 4, 2012 -- 9:09AM, GottaGoToMo wrote:


I can feel the edge of this cliff getting closer and closer.


My money is that they go over it ... a lot easier for the Republicans to vote for tax cuts in January, than it is for them to vote for tax increases on anyone in December.





BINGO! Some (R) after the election woke up and came out on the side of the voters. But there are still some (R) that are still scared of Grover.




The tea party backed Congressmen/women know they have to get re-elected!





sounds like a weak president to me...  he had 4 years and got away with blaming someone else, now he has 4 more years and he still is playing the blame game...  what makes anyone here think that this guy will actually lead and make compromises? - you all got what you voted for, enjoy!




Yes we did, we got exactly what we voted for and we love it. Just think, he can't run again so he is free to do whatever he wants. Scary isn't it? And remember what Obama said to Russia? Be scared Artie, be very scared!  BWAHAHAHAAA!!!!!!

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