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$15 living wage
8 months ago  ::  Nov 06, 2018 - 8:34PM #41
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 15,626

Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:27PM, bertram wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:25PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:00PM, bertram wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 7:16PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 6:52PM, bertram wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 6:49PM, 2BBobby wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 6:22PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


That’s a straw man, of course there are skilled illegal immigrants and there are also unskilled ones.  All the labor laws; vacation, overtime, FMLA, the ACA, etc.  They can’t demand it all because some they don’t qualify for and they risk deportatio if they report their employer.  Enforce E-Verify.  There are certainly day laborers and people in the fields not getting minimum wage and their required breaks.  If it is inhumane not to have this legislation then enforce it.


What demands can a person with no GED or grasp of the native language make?  They get exploited usually by their own and take what they can get.  Look who is operating the kiosks in the malls in border and port cities.




~~~~~~~~~


Since your responses more often than not ignore the central question, I'll employ your tactics.


"All the labor laws; vacation, overtime, FMLA, the ACA, etc."


Considering your general "libertarian" philosophy, is it fair and accurate to assume you'd prefer to see no laws regarding employer/employee regulations, benefits, etc.?




Somalia is the Libertarian utopia...




I am no anarchist.  Somalia is under the nihilistic caprice of warlords.  I believe in inalienable rights and the Bill of Rights




Does that include the right to clean air and water?  The right to be free of corporate-led endangerment of citizens that comes from deregulating or not regulating industries that produce harmful byproducts that foul our environment and kill people?  You support a party that embraces such corporations and such policies.  How about the right to an education?  You appear to favor charter schools that get to select their student body members and pluck them away from the rest of the "riff-raff" in the general population.  And the taxpayers, many of whose children are relegated to the regular public schools, are forced to pay for what is essentially a "private school" that your kid attends?


The preamble to our Constitution says something about the general welfare:


"...promote the general welfare..." 


This phrase meant that the well-being of the citizens would be taken care of as well as possible by the Federal government.  Do you think Republicans are doing that?




Businesses should be accountable in our courts through tort law, I think the Government should have been held accountable when they have run afoul with things like asbestos in construction and Agent Orange in Vietnam.




The Republicans want to "reform" tort law...in other words, roll it back.  You with 'em on that?




No, that is not consistent with protecting our inalienable rights.  We get few perfect choices.


I did go back and answered you about schools.

8 months ago  ::  Nov 06, 2018 - 8:55PM #42
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 15,626

Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:33PM, 2BBobby wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:02PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


What would you call it?  Classical liberal?  The term liberal has been redefined.  Austrian Economics?  Ignorant unread reporters and progressives called Ron Paul a National Socialist for that, terribly ironic.




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The term liberal has been redefined."


Same is true with the term "conservative", which is why I generally avoid using those words. You and others misuse the word "socialist" to fit your agenda.


I read your posts; obviously music is important to you. Consider this:


Neal Peart has often been categorized as an Objectivist and an admirer of Ayn Rand. This is largely based on his work with Rush in the 1970s, particularly the song "Anthem" and the album 2112; the latter specifically credited Rand's work. However, in his 1994 Rush Backstage Club Newsletter, while contending the "individual is paramount in matters of justice and liberty," Peart specifically distanced himself from a strictly Objectivist line. 


In a June 2012 Rolling Stone interview, when asked if Rand's words still speak to him, Peart replied, "Oh, no. That was forty years ago. But it was  important to me at the time in a transition of finding myself and having faith that what I believed was worthwhile." 


Although Peart is sometimes assumed to be a "conservative"" or "Republican" rock star, he has criticized the Republican Party by stating that the philosophy of the party is "absolutely opposed to Christ's teachings." In 2005 he described himself as a "left leaning libertarian" and is often cited as a libertarian celebrity. 


In July 2011, Peart reiterated those views, calling himself a "bleeding-heart libertarian".


In a 2015 interview with Rolling Stone, Peart stated that he supports the Democratic Party.




I enjoy Rush and Ayn Rand.  I am not an Objectivist, I am not a creator but have the utmost respect for anyone that puts themselves out there and take personal risks.  Rand got a little weird for me with the sexuality in her books and supposedly her personal life.  She did escape a brutal regime and promoted a lot of great conversations.  My voice musically is bass guitar so Rush is right up my alley.  I don't have to agree with the performers I enjoy politically.  Will Farrell can knock on doors and promote candidates I don't agree with but he will still make me laugh unless if he goes bitter.  I love jam band music, they are mostly modern day hippies so I doubt they agree with me on much.

8 months ago  ::  Nov 06, 2018 - 8:58PM #43
2BBobby
Posts: 3,912

Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:55PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


I don't have to agree with the performers I enjoy politically.  




~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Point is...not unusual to think we know it all at 45. I suspect, like Neal, your views will evolve.

8 months ago  ::  Nov 06, 2018 - 9:02PM #44
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 15,626

Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:58PM, 2BBobby wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 8:55PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


I don't have to agree with the performers I enjoy politically.  




~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Point is...not unusual to think we know it all at 45. I suspect, like Neal, your views will evolve.




Possibly.  Have I mentioned my age?  Not 45 until May, if not you are good.


I just feel that principles that you expect to apply in personal interactions with strangers should not change dramatically when you change the scale.  Micro-economic principles still apply in macro-economics but with a great degree of elasticity because of how little focus we have on the big picture.

8 months ago  ::  Nov 06, 2018 - 9:19PM #45
2BBobby
Posts: 3,912

Nov 6, 2018 -- 9:02PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


Possibly.  Have I mentioned my age?  Not 45 until May, if not you are good.


I just feel that principles that you expect to apply in personal interactions with strangers should not change dramatically when you change the scale.  Micro-economic principles still apply in macro-economics but with a great degree of elasticity because of how little focus we have on the big picture.




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


The tone of your posts is fairly indicative of your age...which should say something. Principles are, and should be, formed as a result of real life interactions with people, not abstracts. 


8 months ago  ::  Nov 07, 2018 - 9:28AM #46
Max
Posts: 42,830

Nov 6, 2018 -- 4:35PM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


Nov 6, 2018 -- 4:32PM, Max wrote:


Meanwhile, while Trump has his supporters distracted by watching the caravan. He should be angry and complaining about what's going on in Wisconsin, especially after the tax break that company got. 




Oops: Trump’s Foxconn Deal Is Creating Wisconsin Jobs for Chinese Workers


After Wisconsin taxpayers gifted the company $4.5 billion in subsidies.


www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/11/trumps-f...




Are they earning a living wage?





 I'd say the $4.5 billion in subsidies that company got in American taxpayer money to hire American workers and not Chinese workers goes far beyond a living wage.

.
8 months ago  ::  Nov 07, 2018 - 12:48PM #47
MajorYankFan
Posts: 32,868

Contrary to the beliefs of right-wing socialists, higher wages is important in a supply-and-demand economy.


WAGES


Image result for i want to take you higher

8 months ago  ::  Nov 08, 2018 - 7:10AM #48
yankoldfan
Posts: 7,086

I take it the title of this thread $15 living wage is about minimum wages ?? I get a kick out of the people that say McDonalds couldn't afford to pay their burger flippers $15 per hour, that's BS, all they have to do is add a few pennies on their products, that would make it up in a heart beat.. Then people say, they wouldn't eat at McDonalds because they would be too expensive, what the hell, people are going to eat at McDonalds and every other place just like it, why, because the households today are too damn lazy to go home and cook a meal, that's the make up of 75% of the people in this lazy country.. Again why do you see the minorities are the only ones doing the $hit jobs ?? The hypocrite cons would go crazy if they had to do the work the minorities are doing, Mexicans come to this country to work their a$$'s off and donald wants to call them drug dealers, rapist, murders and anything he can think of.. Stop and smell the roses cons, this country doesn't want to work and most if not all of these illegal aliens as donald calls them do..

8 months ago  ::  Nov 08, 2018 - 7:47AM #49
louisiana_lightning
Posts: 15,626

Nov 8, 2018 -- 7:10AM, yankoldfan wrote:


I take it the title of this thread $15 living wage is about minimum wages ?? I get a kick out of the people that say McDonalds couldn't afford to pay their burger flippers $15 per hour, that's BS, all they have to do is add a few pennies on their products, that would make it up in a heart beat.. Then people say, they wouldn't eat at McDonalds because they would be too expensive, what the hell, people are going to eat at McDonalds and every other place just like it, why, because the households today are too damn lazy to go home and cook a meal, that's the make up of 75% of the people in this lazy country.. Again why do you see the minorities are the only ones doing the $hit jobs ?? The hypocrite cons would go crazy if they had to do the work the minorities are doing, Mexicans come to this country to work their a$$'s off and donald wants to call them drug dealers, rapist, murders and anything he can think of.. Stop and smell the roses cons, this country doesn't want to work and most if not all of these illegal aliens as donald calls them do..




Remove the safety net and you will see them get to work.  It would do most Americans good to not know where their food, clothing, or shelter will come from.  Why should it be any surprise that those that came to the decision of leaving all they know and love to a strange land would be more motivated than those that have never been challenged or felt the motivation of fear?

8 months ago  ::  Nov 08, 2018 - 7:52AM #50
MajorYankFan
Posts: 32,868

Nov 8, 2018 -- 7:47AM, louisiana_lightning wrote:


Nov 8, 2018 -- 7:10AM, yankoldfan wrote:


I take it the title of this thread $15 living wage is about minimum wages ?? I get a kick out of the people that say McDonalds couldn't afford to pay their burger flippers $15 per hour, that's BS, all they have to do is add a few pennies on their products, that would make it up in a heart beat.. Then people say, they wouldn't eat at McDonalds because they would be too expensive, what the hell, people are going to eat at McDonalds and every other place just like it, why, because the households today are too damn lazy to go home and cook a meal, that's the make up of 75% of the people in this lazy country.. Again why do you see the minorities are the only ones doing the $hit jobs ?? The hypocrite cons would go crazy if they had to do the work the minorities are doing, Mexicans come to this country to work their a$$'s off and donald wants to call them drug dealers, rapist, murders and anything he can think of.. Stop and smell the roses cons, this country doesn't want to work and most if not all of these illegal aliens as donald calls them do..




Remove the safety net and you will see them get to work.  It would do most Americans good to not know where their food, clothing, or shelter will come from.  Why should it be any surprise that those that came to the decision of leaving all they know and love to a strange land would be more motivated than those that have never been challenged or felt the motivation of fear?




OK then, let's remove the safety nets for the corporate welfare state


and let it work for its money, instead of ripping off the government,


consumers, workers, and small businesses.

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